Tennessee Firearms Assoc. Inc.

I work at a community college. As I understand it there is no way to have a gun in a vehicle on school grounds. Well, the one exception is to pick up or drop off someone/something if I understand that correctly.

This means for me, or anyone attending a meeting on school grounds, we cannot in any way, have a gun in our car. It can't be locked in the trunk and further locked in a gun safe. There is just no legal way.

So I'm stuck. I travel to school before daylight; on days I have night classes, I travel home after dark. If anything happens between school and home, I am defenseless. Car breaks down, I'm without a gun; whatever. This is such a PITA! Is there any hope of getting a bill passed that would allow us to have at least an unloaded gun in a lock box in the car while we are on campus?

Are you a student? As in, do you take classes, or do you simply work at the school?

It took 15 years to change the law on restaurants. We have, during that same time, been presenting legislation to address a variety of topics on schools.

You ask whether there is hope to improve the law with respect to school grounds. Certainly, that is possible. However, it is less likely with Beth Harwell sitting in the Speaker's office. She will set the tone and much of the agenda for what categories of legislation will be "favored" and she will have the ability, as Naifeh demonstrated, to kill vast categories of legislation in the subcommittee system.

If Tennessee's conservatives and firearms owners continue to want change we can acknowledge that it is now more likely with the Naifeh era continuing to end and with increases in conservatives in the House. However, Harwell's presence signals a significant presence of RINO's, left leaning Republicans and "moderates" at best in the Republican control of the Tennessee House and they do not generally support those fundamental rights which seem to have "politically correct" adversaries.

Is there hope, I'd say yes but not anytime soon.

I have a suggestion as to your situation of being unarmed going to and from school. Think about this. Stop before you get to campus and unload and break your firearm down into pieces. Hopefully you have a pistol and not a revolver. Put the pieces in different parts of your vehicle; slide in the trunk, receiver in the front along with mag/ammo, all three in different places. Now, you don’t have a firearm, all you have are firearm parts. When you leave campus, put your firearm back together. I realize that this is not convenient but at least you are not unarmed going to and from campus.

Maybe you should consider pepper spray as an alternative; it would be good to have while you are unarmed. I don’t know how schools rule on pepper spray; better check this out for yourself.

I'm certain that my post will bring out some interesting replies but who knows what brainstorming will come up with.

My wife teaches at Northeast State Community College and asked the chief of the campus police about this. He asked the TN DOS:

"If a person has a valid Tennessee Handgun carry permis is it legal to have a firearm on a public school campus (K-12 or college) if it is not handled and remains locked in a private vehicle at all times?

"I see the law states 'It is not an offense under this subsection (c) for a nonstudent adult to posses a firearm, if the firearm is contained within a private vehicle operated by the adult and is not handled by the adult, or by any other person acting with the expressed or implied consent of the adult, while the vehicle is on school property.'

"However does that cover a campus posted with the requied no weapons signage and does that law also protect employees of that school?"

Their response

"Dear Sir:

"Your email was forwarded to me for response.

"It is legal for a person who has a Tennessee Handgun carry permit and who is a nonstudent adult to have a firearm contained in a locked vehlcle and not handled by the adult by any other person acting with the expressed or implied consent of the adult, while the vehicle is on school property, unless the campus has otherwise posted a prohibition on the carrying of handguns pursuant to TCA 39-17-1359

"The law refers to nonstudent adults, which would include employees of schools.

"Sincerely,

"Lizabeth Hale
"Staff Attorney
"Tennessee Department of Safety"

The campus police chief stated this means that an employee can have the firearm in their vehicle unless the campus is posted properly just as any other business must do to preclude such action. My wife now leaves her firearm in the vehicle while she teaches.

(b) (1) It is an offense for any person to possess or carry, whether openly or concealed, with the intent to go armed, any firearm, explosive, explosive weapon, bowie knife, hawk bill knife, ice pick, dagger, slingshot, leaded cane, switchblade knife, blackjack, knuckles or any other weapon of like kind, not used solely for instructional or school-sanctioned ceremonial purposes, in any public or private school building or bus, on any public or private school campus, grounds, recreation area, athletic field or any other property owned, used or operated by any board of education, school, college or university board of trustees, regents or directors for the administration of any public or private educational institution.

(2) A violation of this subsection (b) is a Class E felony.

(c) (1) It is an offense for any person to possess or carry, whether openly or concealed, any firearm, not used solely for instructional or school-sanctioned ceremonial purposes, in any public or private school building or bus, on any public or private school campus, grounds, recreation area, athletic field or any other property owned, used or operated by any board of education, school, college or university board of trustees, regents or directors for the administration of any public or private educational institution. It is not an offense under this subsection (c) for a nonstudent adult to possess a firearm, if the firearm is contained within a private vehicle operated by the adult and is not handled by the adult, or by any other person acting with the expressed or implied consent of the adult, while the vehicle is on school property.

(2) A violation of this subsection (c) is a Class B misdemeanor.

So, the Staff Attorney says it's ok under subsection (c), but what about subsection(b)?

Can't they charge you with an offense to almost the exact same law?
Minus some select words and the last sentence of subsection (c), they are almost the same.

As in every case there is only hope if we participate in the process. Make sure you voice your concerns to your state representative and state senator. You can find them here: http://www.capitol.tn.gov/legislators/

I have brought up this problem with my rep and told them the confusion 39-17-1309 and 39-17-1310 cause. One says the only defense is picking up and droping off passengers and educational purposes and the other says a "non-student adult" is allowed as long as it is in the car.

This is also causing problems with hunter safety at school. Some schools will only let toy guns be used in the hunter safety courses because they think the instructor will be in violation of 1309.

My rep said he will introduce a bill on this to clearify what this means.

By the way in Alabama permit holders can carry in school and have been allowed to for many years with no problems.

Alabama law 13A-11-72 (e)

Section 13A-11-72
Premises of a public school. The term "public school" as used in this section applies only to a school composed of grades K-12 and shall include a school bus used for grades K-12
(c) Subject to the exceptions provided by Section 13A-11-74, no person shall knowingly with intent to do bodily harm carry or possess a deadly weapon on the premises of a public school.
(d) Possession of a deadly weapon with the intent to do bodily harm on the premises of a public school in violation of subsection (c) of this section is a Class C felony.
(e) Law enforcement officers are exempt from this section, and persons with pistol permits issued pursuant to Section 13A-11-75, are exempt from the provisions of subsection (c) of this section.